Trainers,

as previously reported, Niantic has introduced a new security measure popularly dubbed “App blacklist”, which scans the players device for third party cheating apps. If any are detected, the game refuses to start and a “black screen of death” is shown.

As of today, it seems that Niantic’s blacklisting security measure doesn’t have a bright future, especially on iOS devices, where a crucial iOS bug (CVE-2017-13852) was fixed, disabling access to the list of installed apps on an iOS device. This bug was affecting all iOS devices prior to iOS 11.1.

According to a tweet from Pepijn Bruienne, a Mac enterprise administrator and a Mac administrator at the University of Michigan in Ann Arbor, the bug that enabled apps to sniff around the installed apps list is no longer active:

The full CVE-2017-13852 description:

An issue was discovered in certain Apple products. iOS before 11.1 is affected. macOS before 10.13.1 is affected. tvOS before 11.1 is affected. watchOS before 4.1 is affected. The issue involves the “Kernel” component. It allows attackers to monitor arbitrary apps via a crafted app that accesses process information at a high rate.

Although initially very effective, the blacklisting feature has since been disabled. The full history of the blacklist warning screen is as follows:

The state of the blacklisting security measure

Niantic has to be given credit where credit is due: the blacklisting feature, once activated, will stop hundreds and thousands of casual Android spoofers.

However, while this security measure is surely commendable, it’s important to be aware that a number of workarounds have already been found in the cheating community. From re-packaged client apps to cheating apps renames, we’ve observed a number of methods that defeat this security measure.

Apple’s removal of the above mentioned security hole is just another “nail in the coffin”, indicating that the blacklist, albeit partially successful, will not completely curb cheating and spoofing in Pokémon GO.

In the end, a few important questions remain unanswered:

  • Will Niantic punish detected spoofers?
  • Will spoofers remain active players if forced to play without location mocking?
  • Will the blacklist be re-activated in the near future?

We don’t have an answer to any of these questions, but we do hope we will have it in the nearby future. Stay tuned for updates.

  • Judith Flow

    Can’t they just ban all those “players” who travelled several thousand miles within an hour to attend the Seoul Festival, and not only that, but also managed to get back to their “regular” region within an hour again to recap all the gyms?

    • Daniel Doiron

      Nope, spoofers spend more money then the casuals on raid passes alone, that’s why none were banned to date from niantic

      yet IV app are more dangerous of players getting shadowban lol…

      • the2000guy

        What a stupid excuse to justify play illegally. Maybe the excuse for people to sell drugs like heroin and cocaine is because there is no job available 😂

        • Alex Joseph Marc Elric

          Yeah because spoofers kill people right? Dumbass.

          • Andreas Mouzouris

            Spoofers killed the game…..end of story…if you cant see that then you are the dumbass m8!!

          • Adalcamin Tubarioseya

            as far as i can see, spoffers make the gym rework, and spoffers have done the pokemon radars that all actual people use.

          • Andreas Mouzouris

            As far as i can see a pidgey is as rare as a 100% shinny magicarp, enjoy your game i am done 😎

          • Johnny Tang

            Weard and inlogical kind of argument. 👎🤔🙄

          • peponzio

            Not really, but it is a misconception. Spoofers did not make the pokemon radars and bots that many people use to track pokemon in a map.

            Hackers and other field knowers created those bots, apps, and webpages to get money through advertising or simply to help (maybe) players, or they were paid by someone who wanted such tools.

            They may not even be players or active users, while spoofers are harmful because they are active users.

            Also misconception to blame the gym rework on spoofers. Yes it is designed to provide less rewards and more takeovers which spoofers do not benefit from. But this was also meant to allow low level players to engage in battles. The fact that spoofers can still take any gym anywhere at anytime means that it did not really affect them that much.

          • Mike

            That’s BS. How did the spoofers affect you personally while playing the game?

          • Johnny Tang

            Because it is absolutely irritating to Walk around battling gyms for several hours, just to see spoofers take over all the gyms you have taken. Spoofers are Lazy cheaters, nothing more not less, who destroy the game for those of us who plays the game walking and battling Real time on the spot. Spoofers affect the game all the time in my area. And are in no Way seen as either a positive or harmless part of the game.

          • Bibek Das

            Everyone of you hate spoofers but if you were from a rural area then you would have spoofed too. You guys have many gyms and stops in your area but where I live there is neither a single stop nor gym. There is only a pokestop which is situated 75Km away from my place. Its easy to blame spoofers but not everyone spoof to cheat in the game. We want to play the game fairly but we are bound to spoof in order to play it like rest of the players. If Niantic had given a minimum amount of gyms and pokestop in rural areas too like DraconiusGo gave then the quantity of spoofers would have decreased to a large extent.
            And if PoGo bans all the spoofers then all of them will shift to DraconiusGo for sure and that will be a huge loss for Niantic. And as we all know Niantic doesn’t think about the community, they only know how to have a PROFIT.

          • Johnny Tang

            So because you live in a rural area it is ok to cheat and try to destroy the game for the majority of players who use a lot of time walking, battling and raiding etc.
            You are just a chicken stuffed with bad excuses and obviously lacking the ability to se that your spoofing is harming real pokemon Go-players – and ultimately pushing the Real players out of the game. And thats why Niantic is trying to get rid of the Spoofers. You Spoofers can potentially destroy the game because it is almost impossible to beat Spoofers in the long run as a Real player. So if you live in area with many Spoofers or very aggressive Spoofers it is just up Hill All the Way.
            Spoofers are just lazy cheaters.
            Spoofers harm Real players.
            Spoofers has no consideration for other players or the game.
            Spoofers are selfish, pathetic and inmature beings.
            Period!!!

          • Eric Seegers

            Dude, take a chill pill. Not all spoofers are gym hogging maniacs, just the same as many non spoofing players. I know of plenty what you call legit players that follow others around retaking gyms. I’ve suffered from city spoofers camping in my small town gyms & with the new system most don’t bother. Still have some twits that come through & put junk mon in every gym in town. Easy as to kick them out. I have my whole town gold & working on some others. Gone are the days mostly of one team owning whole suburbs or towns. I have a disabled friend who has done many city trips to play, she tried to get enough people to raid locally, but there’s just not enough. Since Niandicks won’t fix the issues for rural players, you can hardly call them all evil & game wreckers for just wanting to be able to participate.

          • Sylvia Chochian

            This excuse of spoofing because you don’t have any gyms or pokestops in your small town is getting old. I understand the frustration, but that is on Niantic, and they just don’t care. The end result of this is that it pushed the rest of the players away to games like Drac Go.

            Draconius Go is a far superior game right out of the gate. They basically took everything PoGo players were complaining about and made their game even better. They listened and understood it’s not just about the profit. Pretty soon the only people left at PoGo will be the spoofers. And you rural players now have an option instead of cheating in PoGo.

            The thing is that people can choose to play both, but the majority of people are just ditching PoGo altogether because they have been fed up for so long with things that never get fixed or even acknowledged by Niantic. The spoofing is a huge problem and I have always said Niantic doesn’t want to ban the spoofers because they spend money in the game. Draconius Go has already successfully shut down DracoMesh, they respond to players promptly, and their app doesn’t glitch or freeze. They have a few kinks they are working out and will be updating soon. It’s just such a better experience and if they continue like this, people will keep abandoning PoGo in droves. All the people switching over are high level PoGo players, mostly all level 30-40. Niantic better wake up because they’re not going to get away with this half assed game they are passing off on people for much longer!

          • Bibek Das

            I appreciate your reply because all that you said is the bitter truth of the game. For Niantic money matters the most and this will be the cause of their shut down.
            And we rural players do have a choice of moving to DraconiusGo instead of cheating in PoGo but the thing is that AR gaming doesn’t matter at all, but Pokemon is something which have a very strong connection with our childhood that is why many of us don’t want stop playing the game anyhow and switch to DraconiusGo.

          • Sylvia Chochian

            Bibek, I too appreciate that you took my comment with the intent it was made, and not as an insult.

            When it comes to the suggestion to just ditch PoGo, I have to admit, your emotional attachment is something I didn’t consider. I was a kid when pokemon playing cards were all the rage. I was never into it, but I get what you’re saying because there are other things that would be nostalgic for me too. I got into PoGo because of my daughter who needed someone to take her around everywhere and when she eventually lost interest in the game, I took it over. I put a lot of hours into it and got halfway to level 33 so I also get the idea that many wouldn’t want to toss away all that work either. I still play my streaks daily and if a gym happens to come up that I can add into I’ll do it, but honestly Niantic took a lot of the motivation away to keep leveling up.

            I guess there is no harm in playing both games. You can try D go out and at least have more opportunities with it, and still keep up with Pokemon Go too. It’s just a suggestion. One thing we can definitely agree on though, is that Niantic is making some really bad decisions with the direction they are taking this game. Now that they have competition, they should think twice and listent to the players. Already, I am noticing gyms around me less occupied, and a few familiar PoGo usernames have popped up in Dgo so it’s not a matter of if, but when Niantic will lose enough of its player base to kill their game.

          • Dusten Morris

            Eh.. it’s the same with someone walking behind you and taking the gym.

          • Johnny Tang

            No it is not. NOT even close to the same. Strange Way of logic you have there. If they follow you, they are out in the real World playing the game. They have to move around and use the same time I do.
            When you spoofe, you Don’t move around and you Can take the gyms in no time again and again, compared to Real players.
            You argument is just anorher example of typical thieves logic.

          • Reggie Curtis

            No – that’s playing the game

          • Mike

            That kind of sounds like a game development problem more than a spoofer problem. They should revamp the gyms so that any person, spoofer or regular player, aren’t just getting kicked out of gyms after a few moments. Ive toally had the same thing happen to me by actual real players. It’s annoying. I agree. But again, whether they are actually there or not doesn’t affect actual game play.

          • Reggie Curtis

            1. Spoofing in to retake a gym that you’ve walked miles to take out.
            2. Spoofing in to catch Pokemon that no-one else has in your region for bragging rights.
            3. Spoofing in to catch really rare Pokemon for the candies (and having lots of high level Blissies as a result).
            4. Spoofing in before an ex raid to stop a gym being neutral (to benefit all the players at the raid).
            …there must be other reasons…

          • JuJu On that beat

            damn your feet must hurt from walking ‘miles’ to take these gyms down. they do have these neat things called cars nowadays

          • Reggie Curtis

            How old do you think I am ffs – first car was 1885 although to be fair probably wouldn’t go over the app speed limit

          • Chris Seals

            Miles? What are those? My game only lets me travel in kilometers. : )

          • peponzio

            At least we are not speaking lightyears. I still have to walk so much to count my first lightyear.

          • Reggie Curtis

            I haven’t gone metric yet

          • Dusten Morris

            Niantic inability to fix bugs and make a fame that doesn’t freeze up and crash every 5 minutes killed the game. Someone spoofing to catch pokemon doesn’t effect me at all.

          • the2000guy

            Are you mad because I said the truth? You need to take your drugs and go to bed 😂. Crybaby 😂

          • Mike

            You’re comparing a felony with breaking the terms of service for mobile game. Not even close to “saying the truth”.

      • Andreas Mouzouris

        Besides spoofers there are also sponsors that pay millions for sponsored locations!! What about THEIR money ?why niantic is leaving them investing huge amount of money when in the same time people can enjoy the sponsored benefits without physical presence! And one more thing! If niantic wants the spoofers to be unharmed why they are shadowbanning them for months? I know spoofers who totaly quitted the game for real after receiving a shadowban for the second time!!!

      • Abunja 45

        Another one with a flawed sense of logic. Bro:
        >spoofers spend more money then casuals
        You don’t even have something to back your claim. Casuals (die-hard, hardcore gamers, if that’s what you’re referring to) spend equally or even more, which in some extent even rent-a-car and drive the city whole day just to do raids, which is some takes 30+ legendary raids in total. Take note, they don’t do it on a daily basis. Whereas compared to a spoofer, they’ll just take whatever is available on any given time of the day since 1 free pass a day will suffice. They might spend if they feel like it, but hey, they just remembered that they have 10k worth of coins that they saved before the gym rework so they probably just use that.

        There’s nothing to “lol’ed” about if you’re using a third-party app, regardless if it’s an IV checker. Just follow the TOS, it’s either keep up or shut up.

        • JuJu On that beat

          please post your reference

        • Daniel Doiron

          ALL the spoofers known in my town have done 400-600 + raids, and i’m at 200 ish done and i play daily, so yes spoofers/hardcores spend the most money and time in game, casual just play when they feel like it/ something new.

          I don’t need ‘claims’ its basic knowledge if your high level as me, and know the best/active players of your area.

    • the2000guy

      Niantic should ban this people period… In my country most of the people left the game due to spoofers taking over gyms and not allowing other player trying to get some coins. So this answer the question whether or not spoofers really spend money on this game. Most of people who really spend money play legally!!!

      • Adalcamin Tubarioseya

        If your city is rural area, niantic is careless about your community, so they don´t even noted that your country stoped playing the game

        • the2000guy

          No, I live in a rural area but I travel everyday to the a very dense city with over 15 gyms that people used to play every day to get coins. And Niantic knows very well that a lot of people in that area spend money in this game and play legit.

      • Andreas Mouzouris

        I agree with you! Everybody i know quitted cause of spoofing but you are wrong about money cause spoofers do way more raids than legits and raid costs 1dollar each!!!

        • the2000guy

          I don’t know how familiar are you with spoofing but in my country I know people who spoofed since the game launched and they collected 100 coins everyday until the gym rework that now only collect only 50. We are talking about thousands of coins which not everyone spend them in lures, and incubator after maxing out their storage. So, that leave them with plenty coins to spend in raids. And also 1 free raid pass allow them to play at least once and get enough rare candy and golden razzberries. Also, not to forgot that when the game came out people cheated to obtain up to 9000 coins in thei accounts and Niantic didn’t do anything about. This game was so exploited that anyone could play easily without leaving their beds and without paying a single dollar.

        • Higher_Ground

          Who says they do more raids? If you live in a city you can potentially do raids all day, every day, and there’s no spoofing required.

          The only difference is that spoofers generally have more free coins on hand. If anything, they spend less due to having more free coins than a similarly devoted player who doesn’t spoof.

          There’s no correlation between spoofing and the number of raids you do in a day. And if experience is anything to go by, the more often you do raids, the quicker you will burn out and grow tired of them.

          • Andreas Mouzouris

            If what you say is correct then i cant see why niantic is keeping spoofers in game!! There is something wrong in your calculations!!!

          • Higher_Ground

            I can’t see why you think “niantic is keeping spoofers in game” when they’re constantly doing things like the article mentions to try and get rid of them. Just because they haven’t succeeded 100% doesn’t mean they aren’t trying. In fact, this shows they ARE trying.

          • Andreas Mouzouris

            They should have give at least 1 permanent ban so far i understand its tough to figure out who is spoofing and who doesnt but not even 1 perma?? For real not even 1??

          • Jayden Plays Pokemon GO

            @Andreas Mouzouris

            Like you said, it’s tough to find the spoofer. And the blacklist app was there chance. So now if they just give Perma-Bans at random some people will be VERY angry if they weren’t spoofing

          • peponzio

            They are giving permanent bans. You just don’t hear about them. Some are appealed, some are not.
            What you will hear is if and when a massive ban goes to spoofers.

        • Johnny Tang

          That you don’t know. You Think they do, but thats only your opinion. I do NOT believe that they use more money than All the devoted hard core Real players.

    • Joe1407

      How would you catch ban a spoofer that, after an over night teleport and there in the morning and stay the week and go’s home in the morning at the end? Just ask FsuAtl for other ways. Only the dum spoofers would be banned.

    • Abunja 45

      Why? Because it’s dangerous. The game may find you behaving suspiciously, but it might be caused by your telco or phone which is acting up and can’t find your actual location. The results may vary but on extreme cases, it does find itself a city away. In other words, they can’t outright ban someone. If anything, their detection system needs to improve further. Since the system gathers data of actual locations, it needs to detect and differ which movement pattern and player behavior is considered “just drifting” and “spoofing”.

    • Biga173rd

      They will lose a ton of money if they do. Spoofers believe it or not make up a huge market share for Niantic. Not making an excuse for it but think about it? For example look how long FSU who is the King of all Spoofers one of the most hated guys, since the game launched still has active an account. And he has 700K worth of followers on his channel which tells you their are a lot of spoofers. This pretty much tells you Niantic ain’t going to banned anyone anytime soon in terms of spoofing. Now IV checkers and bots those accounts will be handled.

      • peponzio

        It is easier to identify a preprogrammed action (bots) than a human action. Eventually all bots can be classified by the repeating actions the make but spoofers make noise, unrecognizable data (or at least harder to classify and identify).

        To people it is obvious when someone travels by spoofing. To a system the information available may not clearly confirm a jump. That’s why spoofers jump safely if they do so in a way information cannot confirm the jump.

        • Biga173rd

          Thanks good info

          • peponzio

            Any day, friend. 🙂

      • Dan

        FSU’s accounts consistently get banned. He has upwards of 100 accounts that keep getting banned.

        And 700K? There are 65 MILLION players in the game. That’s about 1% of the player base. That’s not really a lot.

        • Biga173rd

          Okay

  • Andreas Mouzouris

    I see people everyday insists that spoofers spend real money and thats the reason niantic doesnt perma banning em! What about sponsored location tho? They invested millions of dollars and spoofing actually affecting em! Companies like starbucks and jio dahn invested a lot of money to create more traffic to the buisnesses i bet they dont like it a bit that people can have all the benefits from their pokestop and gyms (especially mewtwo ex raids) without physical pressence! Why niantic doesnt secure all those millions of dollars? Just to earn a couple o bucks from selling passes to spoofers????

    • DreamNicholas Zhi Wei

      Well I’m agree with it that is why spoofers ppl can’t be ban since Niantic think can earn billion of dollars.You should know if ban whole spoofers equal losing money after that Pokémon will be stop , kill mewtwo will be very less ppl think don’t need to think about gen 3,4 so on .

      • Andreas Mouzouris

        According downloads in google play of the most famous gps hacks like fake gps and fly gps i strongly believe spoofers are not more than 20% of the total active players! And some percentage like 10% will not even quit entirely if spoofing is bannable! I dont see why niantic is japertizing everything for that 10-15%!!! The Game will die soon if hackers still play without any serious penalty……

      • Abunja 45

        Going by your logic, it would seem that spoofers are either cash cows or just plain stupid. Why would spoofers pay for an extra if they can obtain in-game currency for free? There’s nothing worth spending in the store except if you like to have tons of raid pass to do legendary raids; which is the most logical reason to spend your paid pass to. There are may be other spoofers who does spend money but I doubt that it would even amount even for a fraction of your estimate. Besides, people who’s already cheating but still pays additionally are special cases and a minuscule of player base, which I believe they find a sense of personal satisfaction doing so. Secondly, I found your Mewtwo statement an utter bollocks. Mewtwo raids here are done privately, to the point that even we have name call if everyone in the lobby is physically present. If else, Mewtwo raids probably made those people get out of their caves and play the game the way it’s intended to be.

    • Christopher Andrew Moore

      The game is for everyone and like it or not if you disclude everyone from mewtwo apart from the selected few the masses will get bored and stop playing. So these sponsered outlets are just another pawn in the let’s disclude portions game. Starbucks in uk aren’t gyms or pokestops but are in us? Sprint stores don’t exist in uk so neither do pokestops or gyms. Wake up if they banned the spoofers

      • Andreas Mouzouris

        Dude a sponsored location is more likeley to have a mewtwo raid its not that mewtwo goes ONLY to sponsored locations! I play legit 100% i am from an island in greece with NO sponsored gyms and i DO have a mewtwo…….

        • Jon Jon Javellana

          Weve been having a lot of sponsored gyms with Mewtwo raids. Even a small kiosk for Starbucks inside a mall had a Mewtwo raid last Saturday lol.

      • peponzio

        These are supposed to be tests. The final form for EX raids should give equal opportunites for all to compete and get a chance at mewtwo and any other EX boss that comes after.

        Starbucks in my country aren’t gyms either and that’s because it is a sponsor partnertship between a country franchise. Other country franchises are not included because negotiations have to be treated separately.

    • Ibrahim Khalil

      They actually make more money from sponsors because of spoofers. They set their fees based on one thing, ADU, Active daily users. More users = more money for Niantic. Plus I can’t imagine the starbucks marketing team is sat there counting how many poeple come to their stop, compared to how many people are actually in their stores. What about the people that will hit a starbucks gym while walking past (which I’m guessing is the majority) even legit players don’t need to physically be in the store to interact with pokestops/gyms.

      • Mike

        It’s actually very simple to calculate spins and calculate their own traffick AND to calculate the sales from the traffick. All Starbucks (and retail stores in general) calculate traffick and conversion.

        • peponzio

          Also, it feels more like a publicity deal. It’s basically a map saying: “Here’s a starbucks”. Then you choose what to do with that information.

          There is no reason to link the game with a sponsored sell. Niantic and sponsors negotiate their deals and exchange the info they need to make those decisions. It’s the same for any kind of publicity deal, you are guaranteed to be seen, not to be bought.

      • Dan

        I can tell you from experience that at raids at Starbucks, I typically do buy something.

  • Vin Ver

    Is there several risks in getting installed calcy ivs? Does it figures in blacklisted app?

    • Greg

      We use IV GO. Nothing has ever happened.

    • Jayden Plays Pokemon GO

      Just use websites. You have to punch it in but it’s still safe

    • Dan

      Poke Genie uses screenshots. As long as you’re not letting the app log into your account, you’re fine.

  • the2000guy

    Is time for Niantic to turn on the switch as the early days of the game when they banned hundreds if not thousands of accounts. Most of the people who was banned cheated using fake location apps. Is this unfair? Of course not, they broke the rules and in order to respect, they must follow the rules as is. Now Niantic loss millions of users for allowing spoofers due whatever they want to do with their own game… What a disgrace for such a great franchise!!!

    • Chris Seals

      GPS location fakers are not detectable. Niantic can only do what’s physically possible, unless you are suggesting they break Apples TOS to enforce their own.

  • Greg

    Way too late for such a measure as punishing or disabling spoofing. We have been complaining and filing documented complaints to Niantic for months and months. For nothing. Zero, nada. No spoofer ever got banned. Not one! Majority of our already halved rural PoGo community is now spoofing for otherwise not being able to win any raid other than tier one raid boss, let alone the legendaries. Some of them are buying coins for raid passes. Disabling them would de facto mean the last nail in the game’s coffin. My proposal is different: legalize spoofing, add a feature of your own. Whoever wants to do it without it, can still do it. Those who can’t will have more fun and more joy and more sympathy for otherwise ignorant company. BTW..DraGo players community is growing rapidly..Gyms look BORING with tier 1 and tier 2 raid bosses. Almost no one is playing.

    • Christopher Andrew Moore

      If you defending the gym you should be doing the raid then they can justify not actually being present would get more people back playing had to raid raiku with 6 lvl 30+ in and my household included 3 and there was another guy who had 2 devices and 1 in air

      • Greg

        Spoofers are not an issue at defending the gym these days as you can do the feeding remotely. They are useful at raids. And even if not everyone can be present, a raid can still be organized by your local community. Some ppl will come, others will “come” from their offices/homes, You can make a private group if you want to exclude outsiders. It’s about having fun isn’t it. There are different paths towards the same destination.

        • Matt Scala

          no but they shouldnt be able to take down gyms at 11:59 pm to prevent others from getting their daily coins that they earned for being in there. Thats what annoys me the most about spoofers. let them raid, idc i call it calling in air support, but they should not be able to attack and take down gyms imo

          • Greg

            Never heard of this. It’s mean 🙂 In most cases I notice players being respectful to those possessing gyms for less than four hours. At least I am. There are many gyms available, some of them half empty. In any case, you can feed your mons remotely. Actually giving a golden berry to the first one in a row at 11:57 PM should do.

          • Higher_Ground

            no one should have to waste golden razz berries to fight off a spoofer 🙁

          • peponzio

            So it wouldn’t matter if cheaters raid but they can’t cheat on defending gyms? It is still cheating and if you allow them to cheat on something then someone else can allow them to cheat on something else.

            What if someone doesn’t care about gym defending because he lives beside a gym and can defend it whenever. He wouldn’t care if others cheat on defending as long as cheaters help him in raids when he needs them. Right?

            We all are selfish to some extent, but that is nowhere near a solution. If you don’t like cheaters then don’t give them freedom to cheat elsewhere, remind them that they are hurting your gameplay. Regardless of how it might help you or others it IS in affect affecting you.

        • Partysaurus Rex

          Just stop okay. The “air support” that people refer to as “useful in raids” is far more to their own personal benefit than it is to the group. These spoofers that show up 1 or 2 at a time need the group far more than the group needs them. They are parasites. Prior to the gym rework everyone was pissed when a gym was monopolized by players you never saw. Now that they are marginally “useful” you want to defend them? F**ck no. If you’re willing to allow people to destroy the integrity of the game for your own personal gain, you’re no better and the community is better off without either one of you.

    • Higher_Ground

      so more than half of half a rural community?

      There’s more legit players within a mile of me and I don’t live in a big city.

      It sucks that Niantic doesn’t care about rural players but from a numbers perspective it does make sense. They don’t add up to but a fraction of urban/suburban players. In the US for example (a fairly large and spread out country) over 80% of the population lives in urban areas.

      • Greg

        We got 5 gyms about 5 miles away from where I live and none here (we’re located within the city boundaries). Unfortunately the center is now closed for traffic because they have started digging for archeological artifacts and it’s a mission impossible to find a toll free parking lot in the vicinity of gyms. Niantic, as always, has turned a blind eye for additional gym requests.

  • Christopher Andrew Moore

    They could very easily ban every spoofer. Would there be any raiders left if they did?
    Most I hear from the community only go on to hit streak bonus then go back to playing Draconius go as drago actually listen and improve there game based upon feedback from users. Rather then niantics approach which is as follows 1: listen to all the noise
    2:have a meeting with ceo
    3:write up a bull💩 statement highlighting some of the issues being moaned about
    4: take little or no actions to correct the complaints
    5:re-iterate your working on it and your delayed by 6 months.
    (I make it 18 months by my calculations)
    6:disclude the vast majority in order to make more money.

    • Greg

      Yep. Very true. Streak bonus + eventually one free raid while hopelessly waiting for ex raid invite. DraGo’s Rosebud looks very similar to M2. Most of us already caught it.

    • Mike

      They wouldn’t make any money if they did. That’s the real reason they haven’t slammed the ban hammer. They are trying to balance the IAP from spoofers (because obviously they spend more than legitimate players) and the marketing revenue they receive from Starbucks and Sprint (and others) they obviously make more money from spoofers, but the marketing money is substantial enough that they don’t want to lose it, but they stores aren’t going to want to dish out money for a service that people can cost them money when they are nowhere near their business.

      • Abunja 45

        I don’t think they wouldn’t make money if they do. Being someone who have work (no time; more money) mean they’re likely the ones who cheat compared to someone who has time to play (no work; less money) is like it’s a given fact because it’s a sound logic. No, I believe mostly are not. In fact, I find them the most dignified players around for their hardwork. For what I believe, spoofers were, unlike legit players, have a choice to not to spend money since they have no time nor physical restraints doing so. So I think it’s the other way around.

        • Mike

          I don’t believe it has to do with work or money. It’s convenience and where they live. I work but I also have time to take a 20 min train to NYC on my days off, but that doesn’t mean I want to do that just to enjoy a mobile game.

          • Abunja 45

            Different strokes for different folks, I agree. I just don’t want to generalize that because spoofers apparently generate more money (for some reason beyond me) came from the working classes, which I believe everybody is believing in to.

          • peponzio

            To be honest it’s hard to pinpoint your findings. Who do you find to be the most dignified players? The ones without money but plenty of time? Is it more likely for working class to be spoofers because they have money and little time to move?

            You don’t want to generalize something by expressing your generalized findings.

            I agree with @MdotRdot:disqus , I don’t think it has to do with work or money. I work and am a legit player, in fact we have a chat group of working legit class players. Proud and dignified.

            And I know more people than I wish I knew that actually spoof during work. And I know people with plenty of time but no money who spoof because they cannot travel around the city or don’t want to waste time and money on buses.

          • Abunja 45

            If that is a reply from my parent post, I apologize if I worded it too hard to be understood properly, but I mean it to the former. I am too working and a legit playing casually. There are still people here in suit and ties playing legit on lunch and off-work, which later on I came to know them in-game (Fire and Ice Event). To some extent, they invited me twice on a nearby well-known coffee shop since they’re having a lure party which I both declined because I just can’t find the time to play for too long after work and just suffice playing on the road (I’m a passenger). Then raid comes, I have met many people and who they’re in-game (mostly nearby residents) and the rest is history for me. Though it’s true, I have known some who cheats but they’re a minority from those people I know in-game.

          • peponzio

            Ahh, ok. I really wasn’t sure how to respond. I too have met many through events and raids and it’s fun. But unfortunately I was added to a chatgroup of raiders where spoofing is not frowned to, and I can confirm many young people who spoof out of laziness or no money.

      • Dan

        False. According to the numbers,1% of the player base is spoofing. They wouldn’t lose enough money for it to hurt.

        • peponzio

          I wouldn’t go with numbers, how can it actually be measured how many people spoof? If it was simply certain to know how many there are then there wouldn’t be a problem with banning them all.

          It may be an educated guess or a mathematical approximation but how can anyone acquire such information for a reliable approximation.

          If 1% is according to a youtube’s channel followers compared to the number of game downloads then it’s even worse. There is only correlation and no causation in assuming all followers play AND cheat. While also missing the point that Daily and Monthly Active Users are are less than 9% of total downloads.

          Also, there may be many spoofers who don’t follow but either watch or don’t watch said videos.

        • Mike

          Lol. What numbers? The numbers they provide? Even if those numbers are true, that doesn’t mean much without them providing the sales of those players vs the sales of legitimate. Whales of IAP are already a small demographic, and are who developers cater to. If said whales are in the 1% that you claim are the only spoofers (unlikely that’s the actual number but I’ll go with it) then they would still want to cater to those players. Whales make and break f2p games.

    • peponzio

      Very easily is hard to prove. Even if they had all (true) spoofers identified and it was as simple as “ban to all” button it probably wouldn’t go as we all assume. As for those who play something else, that is really good; may everyone play whatever they want.

      Your points for Niantic’s approach are from your viewpoint and not actual facts. Most probably Niantic has itinerary meetings planned for every week as well as specific meetings planned days ahead. In those meetings many points are reviewed, solutions are agreed to, and actions are delegated.

      Some of the points they (maybe) discuss could be referring to player base comments and concerns. A player base consisting of 750 million downloads and a monthly active base of 65 million people. This is more than 130 times more than a 500,000 download game (assuming all downloads are active players for such a game).

      Many agreements in Niantic’s meetings probably get a pending status as they need to be accepted by franchise owners (Pokemon Co.) resulting in delays and apparent little or no actions. When finally reviewed they may be rejected entirely, meaning hours of discussions wasted in what will become no apparent actions taken. A game owner of its own creatures needs no approval.

      After project evaluations it is only fair to report how far the game is according to where it should be. Reporting a delay takes guts and pride. And no one will ever forget you said you were once delayed. Now, not considering beta, this game has been out for 16 months and even if we were expecting features since launch that would only be unfair to demand something we were told since day 1 it was in development.

      If they give a date, then it may be considered delayed. Otherwise it was an agreement from both parts that features are a work in progress.

    • Chris Seals

      GPS location fakers are not detectable so no, they could not ban every spoofer unless they ban every player.

    • Dan

      Yes. Yes there would be raiders left. We had a group of 15 last night in the freezing cold for a Suicune.

  • christian

    why can’t they compare the ip address with the gps signal? a german ip adress form f.e Berlin but a american gps location should be enough for a bann!

    • David Wawrzyniak

      um, VPN??? Change your IP to where you are spoofing too… they really can’t stop spoofing since it is funding their dev team. Maybe they should take the 50% of their team trying to stop spoofing, and put them into developing new features? Better yet, make a pokestop/gym submission app, and use them there, and spoofing would slow down a lot more.

    • vision33r

      Why would they use a game client to do a global ip lookup. That would slow or prevent login and cause unnecessary support nightmare. Follow the money and you’ll see why Niantic does.

    • peponzio

      Oh no, Niantic accesses the installed apps and our IPs! This has got to stop, so much privacy invasion! (This is an example of what could happen)

      But being serious, there are many technical limitations with doing such checks. Now again, how many security implementations can be used to detect spoofing before running out of options? How many of them do NOT have a workaround?

  • Andreas Mouzouris

    The game is broken and full of hackers, Niantic is doing nothing either because they dont want or simply because they cant (i personally believe they cant) its been 1 year and a half…..why you all just dont quit already like i did?? Arent you tired of complaining and feelling insulted by Niantic?? They dont deserve your time neither your money! Try a game from a gaming company and not one from a gps company they need years of experience in order for them to become a real gaming company! Ingress is broken, pokemon is broken and trust me in this one harry potter go will be broken , full of hackers and bugs! Try a real game for a change……

    • Greg

      You have already chosen. Why bother? Niantic probably doesn’t bother neither, LOL. Although they should.

      • Andreas Mouzouris

        True

    • Mike

      The hackers aren’t affecting the game though because there is nothing the spoofers can do to the game that you couldn’t do in real life. What’s affecting the game is them not providing content for those who don’t live in major cities.

    • Chris Seals

      If you believe they can’t stop hackers (which you’re right, they can’t) why would you feel insulted by them? You just said you believe it’s beyond their control. Any game that relies on GPS will be broken upon release because you can’t stop GPS fakers. They’re undetectable.

  • vision33r

    Without spoofing Niantic would not release gen 2 as most people are just not lucky enough to catch Lapras. Spoofing pushed Niantic to release more content quickly. Without spoofing, gyms will be dominated by folks who play the game hardcore.

    • Abunja 45

      How Lapras has anything to do with releasing Gen 2 much earlier? If else, I found it plausible if you say that because of hype it has generated since the miners found those data in the master file, which came to fruition 3 months later. Another thing, without spoofing, there’s still this thing called physical limitation. A hardcore gamer who lives 1 mile away from a gym will be always beaten by someone who’s casually playing that live right under it. If you’re talking about “1st Generation” gym, it’s being reworked mainly because it’s not being beginner friendly.

      • vision33r

        Without spoofing a hardcore player would have a high CP defender. Spoofing made it easier for a casual to get high CP Pokemons easier. Spoofing killed the hardcore nonspoofers. Casuals don’t do gyms and they just want to catch randoms. Niantic has an awful spawn system where people live outside of cities get no chance.

        • Abunja 45

          I can’t believe that you need to make a fallacious statement just to back up your claim, and as well contradict it.
          “Spoofing made it easier for a casual to get high CP Pokemons easier.”
          “Casuals don’t do gyms and they just want to catch randoms.”
          Yeah, high CP Pokemons needs to be random.
          You’re telling me that even someone like a casual gamer, if the situation presented itself, would totally ignore a gym? Also, high CP monsters don’t have much use unlike before. Can it still go like defending a gym for an eternity? Can it solo a high level boss raid?
          One thing, a hardcore gamer don’t “die”. Hint: HARDCORE. They will just ignore spoofers and continue playing the game, though they probably see those cheaters as an annoyance.

        • Partysaurus Rex

          Spoofers and other cheaters were the cause of the gym monopoly. Spoofing didn’t solve the gym problem. The cp decay and other mechanics of the gym rework specifically targeted spoofers and those that were dominating gyms. The rework made gyms approachable by lower level players and “casuals” the irony here is that you are trying to demonize “hardcore” players and trying to make it seem like spoofers are some how saving us from those [email protected] dirty players who play the game as intended. How dare they!

    • Partysaurus Rex

      First off Lapras hatches from eggs. Second they were readily available during the ice event, and if you were still unlucky enough not to get one that way, they were a raid for a while there. No sympathy. Second spoofing did not push Niantic to release content more quickly, they flat out said that content was being pushed back while they battled the plethora of dirtbags who were cheating. Stop pretending to be some f**king martyr. The gyms were previously and still are in some places, dominated by people we never see, people that don’t help, don’t contribute, don’t show up to local raids, or take part in community building. If it weren’t for spoofers and other cheaters we would have things like trading, and pvp, and a working EX raid system.

    • Jon Jon Javellana

      You mustve missed the Ice and Fire event… Coz Lapras was everywhere, well, in my area, Tampa XD It was the first time I caught one <3 I was so happy…

  • Mike

    Great! I don’t give a damn about spoofers. This is a security feature that should’ve been implemented a long time ago. Apps don’t need to know what apps are installed on our devices. It’s absurd to think that this is just being implemented.

    • peponzio

      It is a security feature that HAS been implemented a long time ago. The article states that there was a bug in that implementation in certain OSs (plural) and they fixed the bug.

      It was also mentioned before in the other articles that Apple wouldn’t let this work because this security feature had been implemented a long time ago. This isn’t new, it’s just a bug fix.

      • Mike

        Oh that’s good to know. I recall Lyft and Uber being able to read apps as of recently. I didn’t like that. Didn’t feel that apps should be able to do that.

  • Tor-Iver Sørensen

    Worst thing is; they can’t really start trading before the spoofing problem is solved. Or the game is broken.

    • Jayden Plays Pokemon GO

      Well they can. I mean I just need regionals, Unown, and 3 things that are all luck of the egg. They’d probably however rip off lower levels or something

    • Chris Seals

      Then they will never start trading, because it’s impossible to stop GPS location fakers.

      • Dusten Morris

        Really no reason for trading in this game. The regional pokes are crap.

        • Diskus1

          The issue with cheaters is that they will catch and powerup all the best pokemon running around in the forests. With trading, every legal player will then be able to buy powerful “illegal” pokemon… not fun!

          • Andy James Howson

            Just release all the regionals in an event and spoofers wont be able to create a black market selling pokemon

  • Jayden Plays Pokemon GO

    You guys are all arguing like 5 year olds!

    They are attempting to stop spoofers because they see we are annoyed by it.

    They however don’t wanna because like a lot of you are complaining, they spend most money on the game

    So now, Niantic is in a predicament where they need to look like they’re trying to stop it.
    That’s why only Shadow Bans and Soft Bans occur

    They don’t wanna perma ban because some people who are legit will get caught in the crossfire by accident. My brother for instance is legit but last year he got the effects of a soft ban where everything ran after one ball (last ball glitch in a way. Didn’t shake) and he couldn’t spin pokestops

  • Chris Denton

    Am I misunderstanding or is this article telling me that niantic used an exploit to break apples rules, in order to spy on iOS users?

    Isn’t that a violation of the terms between Apple and niantic?

    • peponzio

      Wondering the same. It’s not clear. Doesn’t seem like Niantic would violate such rules but it is stated like they could have been doing it secretly. I never take this articles to heart as they do have the backup facts but the statements are confusing.

      • Chris Denton

        If that’s not what happened this article is just telling us about a bug fix within IOS.

        • peponzio

          Yes. And since it was never available for PoGo it makes it irrelevant to the game.

          But hey it feels like it has something to do with PoGo. Ergo, article in Go Hub.

  • Franswa Harold

    How do people hate spoofers….As far as i know, they have helped me tremendously. I walk, drive and chase pokemon all over dallas tx, and guess what???…those spoofers helped me get lugia, suicnine and entei…so im just saying

    If silph road and niantic simply make a chat style (hempire) type of trading/bartering system and egg incubation stations…

    For example….gamestop, walmart, sprint, boost mobile, starbucks….would be ideal for being sponsored gyms with the bartering and trading of pokemon and all items aquired but only at these sponsored gyms without having to buy a coffee or buy sprint or boost service. Simply pay 25 to 100 poke coin to enter the option to trade/barter, depending on your level, it should be automatic…..1-10, 25 poke coin, 11-20, 50 poke coin…and so forth…

    Trainers should be able to chat/trade within atleast counties, this would cover more areas where people cant get out (disabled) or have very few gyms or decent spawn rates.

    In short, people would spend more time going to a location where they go normally and eventually dont have to spoof as much due to being able to chat and buy/sell/barter/trade.

    If Niantic keeps a lid on continuously dropping more gen’s and work on more avatar items without having to spend poke coins, a chat system, a bartering system, add to the fight system where pokemon have 4 options instead of 2, keep the button tap but 1 bar for something like with pikachu
    (Tap for quick attack or special build, 1 bar for wild charge or paralyze, 2 bars for thundershock and 3rd bar for like when pikachu used steel tail.)

    If Niantic quits trying to be sneaky like with the blacklist app, and work on more of the features we already have, i think it will be easier on non-spoofers and maybe spoofers will calm down.(Most reasons are because they dont stay in new york or santa monica or Jamsil Lotte, Seoul Korea and certain pokemon are unobtainable.)

    And as a non-spoofer, at least you will be able to fill that pokedex or get that hp up for porygon that you’ve been needing for 3 months or just wanna sell all those extra pokeballs that you dont use and eventually end up trashing. Just a thought.

    • Partysaurus Rex
      • Franswa Harold

        Understand why things are the way they are, or continue to have a problem with people who spend more money than non-spoofers. Do you really think niantic will see the revenue they see now if spoofers are banned??? Do your research and see why this is happening instead of being angry at them for spoofing. IJS…

        • Partysaurus Rex

          LOL “do your research” you’re a moron. I know why perma-banning spoofers isn’t a viable option and it has nothing to do with revenue. I’m curious does YOUR “research” factor in the number of players lost and subsequent revenue lost from excessive cheating and abuse of the game? Your “research” probably just writes them off as “losers” and doesn’t even consider it a factor. Sound like a bias, a hidden agenda perhaps? In any case this article and the measures created by Niantic had nothing to do with “banning” spoofers, just stopping the behavior.

          I don’t know of a developer in history that favored revenue over protecting the spirit and integrity of their work. Revenue comes from having a quality game that developers actually care about. I hate to break it to you but normal people have stronger moral fiber than that. None of that matters because I know you don’t have a shred of data to support such an asinine position.

        • Dan

          They are banning spoofers. If you take FSU’s followers into account, along with the total number of downloads, spoofers make up 1% of the player base. There is no way they are outspending legit players. They aren’t perma-banning them because to do that, you need to ban the device. And that won’t work for multiple reasons.

          • Chris Seals

            What kind of math are you using here? FSU has more subs than all of the top “legit” pokemon GO YouTubers. There are more spoofers playing the game than legit players if you go solely off of YouTube subs. Also, spoofers are undetectable unless they do something stupid, like spin a pokestop in LA then spin another in NYC five minutes later, for example. I’m sure there are more technically involved ways to detect GPS location fakers but that would require more resources, both physically and electronically, and we all know hackers usually stay one step ahead at all times so it wouldn’t benefit them for long. On top of that, regardless of the exact numbers, banning GPS spoofers will cut out a huge chunk of Niantic’s IAP profits. There’s no denying that.

          • Dan

            Yeah, no. FSU has about 700K. Mystic7 has 1.6 million. That’s more than double for just him. Trainer Tips adds another 665K. Reversal has 300K. AliA, on his PGo channel, has 4.6 Million. So, no, there are quite a few more followers for the legit players than the main spoofer.

            The numbers I used were FSU’s subscription base (700K) versus downloads (65 Million). There’s aren’t any other spoofing channels, so why doesn’t he have more followers? Spoofing doesn’t have nearly the player base, nor does it have the same financial impact that people claim.

            But, if you want to take another measure into account, let’s look at views on their most recent videos:
            FSU – 21K
            Mystic7 – 67K
            Trainer Tips – 65 K
            Reversal – 28K
            AliA – 281K

            I’m willing to bet that FSU has more repeat viewings since he gives specific instructions, rather than the broad information and general entertainment that’s good for really one view out of the other 4.

            Also, I know several people that play the game that aren’t following anyone, myself included, that play the game legitimately, though I do watch the others videos (except Reversal. His voice bothers me).

            And profits? You’re kidding, right? Spoofers don’t spend money on the game. They can get their coin from gyms regardless of the time of day. They are going to use that coin to get extra raid passes instead of spending real cash. Why would a cheater spend more money? It would give them away.

    • Dan

      – You live in Dallas. I highly doubt you needed spoofers to get those legendaries as you only need 6-7, and my little town was able to do it without spoofers.

      – A barter system or egg incubation stations? I can see the egg thing working, but not the barter system. That would lead to mass chaos because there would be no controls over how much an item or a pokemon’s value is. And being a higher level should not absolve you of the entry “fees”.

      – Chatting with other trainers is a huge privacy violation. Kids play this game. So all it takes is one pedophile to figure out the chat system and try to meet up with kids. Lawsuits would ensue, and our game would be shut down. The chat system will never happen.

      – Niantic isn’t keeping the lid on dropping new generations. We’re getting Gen III next month. We got Gen II about 8 months after game launch. They’re trying not to overload us with everything.

      – I agree with a battle system rework. But your ideas are exactly Trainer Tips ideas.

      – Spoofers won’t stop if you give us PvP, trading, and a new battle system. They’ll be more prevalent because you’ll give them more to do.

      – If trading eventually DOES come out, you shouldn’t be able to get pokedex entries. That will at least keep the spoofers at bay on that one. And you shouldn’t be able to sell pokemon or pokeballs in the real world. Maybe for an in game coin or two, but never in the real world.

  • ikato kiyazaki

    fight poison with posion ? lol

    • peponzio

      fight ice with ice ?

  • ellie langford

    I have an android phone and do not have any cheating apps now I cannot play.

    • Dan

      How so? The app will tell you what apps are blacklisted so you can get rid of them.

  • Danny Nguyen

    This update is pretty much useless. You can just download tutuapp and download the PKMN Go hack, and when PKMN GO is installed, you can delete tutuapp, and the hack still works fine and there’s a higher you can’t be banned or warned for spoofing. But this update can be useful if it can detect that you are spoofing.

  • vision33r

    I don’t even play daily anymore because the content is weak, I miss the different water, fire, and grass events. The legendary raids are a joke and they’re just vanity Pokemons. The gyms are boring because there’s no competition or challenge. Everyone get their 10-50 coins a day and that’s the endgame right there. There’s no more challenge. That’s why most casuals don’t play anymore, it’s not spoofing. Most people I know don’t even know what spoofing is. They got tired of a game that has no regular content update.